genuinely confused?


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wotsits Offline

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Post: #1
genuinely confused?

i just wondered what people on here really want from the club??

I keep hearing about how terrible fat fred was as a chaiman as he spent spent spent trying to buy us success and nearly bankrupt us which i agree is a stupid thing to do and was always going to end in tears

then we have the other extreme of mike ashley who hasnt spent any money at all and has made money on all transfer windows which with other bad decisions led to our relegation. this i also agree is not a way to run a football club.

we then get told we are too impatient with our managers and heve had a ridiculous amount of managers in the last 20 years and the closest we came to success recently was with sir bob and kk who werer here 5-6 yrs a piece.
But surely if a manager does well we should keep him and if a manager cannott get the players to do the simpest thing like pass a ball to one another they should go! so i agree with the way we have treated many of the managers we have.

So what do we really want. Something in the middle would be good but i really cant work it out?
If we go up to the prem we will need an overhaul; of players, 50mil would imo be a minimum to give us a chance of surviving but surely we cant afford that so we would be going the same way as f s did?
or we spend little hoping we can stay up a few seasons and get money in the bank buying cheaper players but not having the debt that cripples teams like ashley is doing??
and do we stand by houghton who imo has done a great job and if promoted by his team deserves a shout at it. but by his own admission he is not good enough!
Or do we get promoted, demote c h and employ a foreign coach who will demand a fortune and if history is anything to do with it will have 6 weeks to prove himself?

I genuinely dont know, maybe we are better off in the championship, less money out and easier teams?

Just my rambles sorry for the long probably makes no sense crap above Wink
11th January 2010 01:11 PM
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Sal Offline

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Post: #2
genuinely confused?

Honesty, integrity, competence & trust is all I want.

From there you get a club you can be proud of regardless of how rich your owner is.

With those values in place, a club like ours could only be a success, we already have the the fanbase and the stadium, the rest would follow.

For some reason no one seems to be able to grasp the simplicity of it.
11th January 2010 01:15 PM
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Chris_NUFC Offline

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genuinely confused?

If we were run say like Aston Villa, the manager backed, the owner ambitious but sensible, then i would be over the moon.
11th January 2010 01:16 PM
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Jinkyjim Online

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Post: #4
genuinely confused?

Football is the most corrupt business in the world...
11th January 2010 01:18 PM
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Brassneck

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Post: #5
genuinely confused?

"Or do we get promoted, demote c h and employ a foreign coach who will demand a fortune and if history is anything to do with it will have 6 weeks to prove himself?"

definately YES.

A top foreign coach would be given time,..allershyte was only given a lot of stick because everyone knew he was shite when he came, and he went on to prove it before our very eyes, he was taking us nowhere and all the criticism was well deserved,..3-0 down, at home, to pompey after only 12 minutes FFS, that was woeful.
11th January 2010 01:18 PM
wotsits Offline

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genuinely confused?

Chris_NUFC Wrote:If we were run say like Aston Villa, the manager backed, the owner ambitious but sensible, then i would be over the moon.

i couldnt agree more but are we too late??
we need more or less an entire new eleven just to get mid table prem football and that is a lot of money.
ashley will want at the very least 150mil for the club if we go up with the investment needed we need an arab sheikh to come in and bail us out.
If only it hadnt been ashley, anyone ekse but that prick and we probably would have been alright.
11th January 2010 01:22 PM
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Chris_NUFC Offline

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genuinely confused?

wotsits Wrote:i couldnt agree more but are we too late??
we need more or less an entire new eleven just to get mid table prem football and that is a lot of money.
ashley will want at the very least 150mil for the club if we go up with the investment needed we need an arab sheikh to come in and bail us out.
If only it hadnt been ashley, anyone ekse but that prick and we probably would have been alright.

I personally think we are screwed.He will hang onto the club, slowly but surely getting every penny back he put in. He will gamble on premier league survival by putting the least amount he can into the club, hoping we stay up while he is here.
11th January 2010 01:29 PM
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The_Flaming_Lip Offline

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Post: #8
genuinely confused?

wotsits Wrote:i just wondered what people on here really want from the club??

I keep hearing about how terrible fat fred was as a chaiman as he spent spent spent trying to buy us success and nearly bankrupt us which i agree is a stupid thing to do and was always going to end in tears

then we have the other extreme of mike ashley who hasnt spent any money at all and has made money on all transfer windows which with other bad decisions led to our relegation. this i also agree is not a way to run a football club.

we then get told we are too impatient with our managers and heve had a ridiculous amount of managers in the last 20 years and the closest we came to success recently was with sir bob and kk who werer here 5-6 yrs a piece.
But surely if a manager does well we should keep him and if a manager cannott get the players to do the simpest thing like pass a ball to one another they should go! so i agree with the way we have treated many of the managers we have.

So what do we really want. Something in the middle would be good but i really cant work it out?
If we go up to the prem we will need an overhaul; of players, 50mil would imo be a minimum to give us a chance of surviving but surely we cant afford that so we would be going the same way as f s did?
or we spend little hoping we can stay up a few seasons and get money in the bank buying cheaper players but not having the debt that cripples teams like ashley is doing??
and do we stand by houghton who imo has done a great job and if promoted by his team deserves a shout at it. but by his own admission he is not good enough!
Or do we get promoted, demote c h and employ a foreign coach who will demand a fortune and if history is anything to do with it will have 6 weeks to prove himself?

I genuinely dont know, maybe we are better off in the championship, less money out and easier teams?

Just my rambles sorry for the long probably makes no sense crap above Wink

The thing is, no offence intended, but what you are talking about here is not rocket science.

With 50,000 gates and all the money that comes into the club just being a Premier League club, not to mention the extra revenue generated by getting into Europe. Well it ought to be harder to fuck it up really. This just goes to show the extraordinary depths the club stooped under that monstrosity Shepherd - and if you need reminding about that then I wonder where you have been for the last 13 years.

To appoint a manager like Souness and hand him £50m is just the tip of the iceberg of Shepherd's idiocy.

To appoint Keegan and then Wise above him is the act of a very stupid man.

"Or do we get promoted, demote c h and employ a foreign coach who will demand a fortune and if history is anything to do with it will have 6 weeks to prove himself?"

Sorry to sound offensive here but are you a mackem taking the piss? Nana

When in Newcastle United's history have they appointed foreign managers who have demanded a fortune?

When has a manager not been given enough time to prove they are totally unsuited to the post?

Do you mean appoint a foreign manager like Arsenal, Chelsea or Liverpool and win trophies?

I am not sure of your agenda here bonnie lad, but if its just to stir it up a bit then its worked with me Tongue

Anyway, to answer your question, all this club needs is someone with an inkling about the possibilities of the club (a look at our recent history illustrates) and the appointment of a half decent manager who is not a cock end.

Cock ends....McGarry, Charlton, MacFaul, Smith, Ardiles, Dalglish, Gullit, Souness, Roeder, Allardyce, Kinnear...

Half decent...Cox, Keegan, SBR.

By sheer laws of probability we must get lucky again soon. Shepherd only got SBR cos he virtually demanded the job - mebber some left field appointment like Lee Clark could be the catalyst. Personally give me a proven foreign coach any day.

And if anyone thinks that NUFC have been only been run by total shitehouses since F Shepherd, you only need to look at what happened to Arthur Cox to see what bastards have run NUFC.

Shame Yeung did could not see beyond Birmingham. There must be more intelligent men out there. There MUST!
11th January 2010 01:31 PM
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DUMFRIESGEORDIE Offline

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Post: #9
genuinely confused?

what i dont want is to be like pompey, yes i want shot of ashley, yes i want investment and yes i want promotion and believe all of these things go hand in hand, if we win the league we get shot of ashley(i hope) and then hopefully new fresh investment but although i am nowhere near happy right now although we are doing way better than i expected i would just like to spare a minute to say things could be worse? just look at pompey? and i must admit we have dropped a division and it hurt like a dagger plunged into your heart, but i have actually enjoyed my footy for the first time in a while and although not wanting 2 seasons in this divison have started to feel proud of my team again, and thats all i ask for. Make me proud.
11th January 2010 01:45 PM
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The_Flaming_Lip Offline

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Post: #10
genuinely confused?

DUMFRIESGEORDIE Wrote:what i dont want is to be like pompey, yes i want shot of ashley, yes i want investment and yes i want promotion and believe all of these things go hand in hand, if we win the league we get shot of ashley(i hope) and then hopefully new fresh investment but although i am nowhere near happy right now although we are doing way better than i expected i would just like to spare a minute to say things could be worse? just look at pompey? and i must admit we have dropped a division and it hurt like a dagger plunged into your heart, but i have actually enjoyed my footy for the first time in a while and although not wanting 2 seasons in this divison have started to feel proud of my team again, and thats all i ask for. Make me proud.

we were going the way of Pompey under Shepherd without a shadow of a doubt.

Personally I have little sympathy for clubs like them as they bought success, without the fan base to back it up (or the personal wealth of the owners). Its not a stretch to say that if their situation had bitten last season then NUFC would not have been relegated.

One positive outcome of the whole Ashley debacle is that NUFC may come out of the whole thing in a better financial position for a new owner than we would ever have been under that shitehouse Shepherd. If we'd have been relegated under that cunt we WOULD have done a Leeds.
11th January 2010 01:51 PM
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wotsits Offline

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Post: #11
genuinely confused?

the flaming lip - I am not on a wind up at all i just genuinely dont know whats best.
We need stability in every form, ownership, management, playing staff and i dont know where we are best suited.
dumfs said it best we are actually enjoying the football at the moment. This has got to be one of the first times since sir bob and i think this speaks volumes.
I would love to see a chairman who has great common sense and a few hundred million to get us back where we derserve and a manager like o neil, wenger, ferguson to keep us there but i cant see it happeneing.
are we better off staying in the chapionship for another season or do we go up and toss a coin on how we stay there?
11th January 2010 01:53 PM
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14andout Offline

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I just want the club run properly! Simple really! I would rather have a club run properly in the Conference than one run shite in the premier league!
11th January 2010 02:05 PM
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lundypete Offline

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genuinely confused?

I dont want this to sound like a "Keegan as Messiah" thread, but I will tell you one thing: it is the only time in my 50 years that I felt there was a manager and board who wanted what we wanted. That wasnt true when SBR was here (the board were shite), and it is clear that SJH didnt do us any favours when he sat back. But for an all too brief period, we had a setup from the top down, who you just felt enjoyed every single minute of their jobs. A sense of pride, a sense of promise, but an overriding sense of FUN!

We might not have had the silverware, but nobody could blame us for not enjoying and loving every bit of what we had. We were the envy of every set of fans in the country, because we were really united in our oulook.

And it was so easy, it really was. Its easy to look at the Shearers, Beardsleys, Ginolas: but it was good before they got here as well. That promotion year was exceptional: with players who knew they werent going to make it in the premiership as individuals, but still nailed their colours to the mast.

However well the team is doing right now, and Houghton and the players should be appreciated, there is not that lack of doubt we had back in the early 90s. There is no hope that something is being built for the future, no sense that the club appreciate any of the fans, or the money they sink into the club. No sense that the fans shoild be entertained.

Under SJH, there were all sorts of developments: the Falcons, talk of Ice Hockey, the motor racing. And we knew it was all a laugh, but we still spent the money, and didnt begrudge one penny of it.

Its the hope that has died.
11th January 2010 02:09 PM
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The_Flaming_Lip Offline

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genuinely confused?

lundypete Wrote:I dont want this to sound like a "Keegan as Messiah" thread, but I will tell you one thing: it is the only time in my 50 years that I felt there was a manager and board who wanted what we wanted. That wasnt true when SBR was here (the board were shite), and it is clear that SJH didnt do us any favours when he sat back. But for an all too brief period, we had a setup from the top down, who you just felt enjoyed every single minute of their jobs. A sense of pride, a sense of promise, but an overriding sense of FUN!

We might not have had the silverware, but nobody could blame us for not enjoying and loving every bit of what we had. We were the envy of every set of fans in the country, because we were really united in our oulook.

And it was so easy, it really was. Its easy to look at the Shearers, Beardsleys, Ginolas: but it was good before they got here as well. That promotion year was exceptional: with players who knew they werent going to make it in the premiership as individuals, but still nailed their colours to the mast.

However well the team is doing right now, and Houghton and the players should be appreciated, there is not that lack of doubt we had back in the early 90s. There is no hope that something is being built for the future, no sense that the club appreciate any of the fans, or the money they sink into the club. No sense that the fans shoild be entertained.

Under SJH, there were all sorts of developments: the Falcons, talk of Ice Hockey, the motor racing. And we knew it was all a laugh, but we still spent the money, and didnt begrudge one penny of it.

Its the hope that has died.

totally agree. and the point of it was, John Hall did not really do anything amazing - he simply appointed a decent manager and when things were working let him get on with it.
11th January 2010 02:12 PM
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The_Flaming_Lip Offline

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genuinely confused?

wotsits Wrote:the flaming lip - I am not on a wind up at all i just genuinely dont know whats best.
We need stability in every form, ownership, management, playing staff and i dont know where we are best suited.
dumfs said it best we are actually enjoying the football at the moment. This has got to be one of the first times since sir bob and i think this speaks volumes.
I would love to see a chairman who has great common sense and a few hundred million to get us back where we derserve and a manager like o neil, wenger, ferguson to keep us there but i cant see it happeneing.
are we better off staying in the chapionship for another season or do we go up and toss a coin on how we stay there?

"I would love to see a chairman who has great common sense and a few hundred million"

I think this where you get things wrong. Cash pours into a Prem club. And with a fanbase like ours it is a license to print money. When you have an owner who is not in it simply to line his own pocket and boost his own ego it works fine.
NUFC is a going concern, and well managed does not need £100m injected into the transfer kitty from external sources.
Potentially we ought to be generating the same money Spurs and Villa make. The Villa owner does not bail out O'Neill.

It is a total misinterpretation of the facts that we need a massive sugar daddy to make us a top 6 side again. We just don't need an incompetent crook. Unfortunately the last two owners have been both.

Lerner is no Abramovich and O'Neill is no SBR or even a Houllier. They are just slightly above the average, which is all that is required to get a biggish club to the top end of the Prem league - Birmingham City are proving that.

It is not beyond the realms of possibility to envisage NUFC battling it out in the top 6 again in the not too distant future. To not see this is to fall for the southern media bias and doom mongers amongst us.

The tragedy of NUFC is however that we so completely fail to do the right thing and achieve our potential so consistently.
11th January 2010 02:20 PM
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rotti Offline

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genuinely confused?

With owners like the Arabs at City we will never in our lifetimes get near to where we once were.

We at best will be a top 10 club sad but true so if people are happy with that then that's fine you will get your wish, but don't kid yourself to think we will ever get into the top 5 never mind the top 4 again. The gap is far too wide between the top 5 and us if we gain promotion. This is not me being my pessimistic self its just a fact unless we also get taken over by some rich Arab.

Im confused because id like us to be in the Premier League but know deep down we will be fighting for survival every season so part of me would like to be a big fish in a small pond in the fizzy pop league, but i know that isn't viable because if we don't go up we will lose what we have in half decent players.
11th January 2010 02:44 PM
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The_Flaming_Lip Offline

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rotti Wrote:With owners like the Arabs at City we will never in our lifetimes get near to where we once were.

We at best will be a top 10 club sad but true so if people are happy with that then that's fine you will get your wish, but don't kid yourself to think we will ever get into the top 5 never mind the top 4 again. The gap is far too wide between the top 5 and us if we gain promotion. This is not me being my pessimistic self its just a fact unless we also get taken over by some rich Arab.

Im confused because id like us to be in the Premier League but know deep down we will be fighting for survival every season so part of me would like to be a big fish in a small pond in the fizzy pop league, but i know that isn't viable because if we don't go up we will lose what we have in half decent players.



Barclays Premier League table


Barclays Premier League : Table
Saturday, 9 January 2010 19:38 UK
| Home | Away
Team P W D L F A W D L F A GD PTS
1 Chelsea 20 9 1 0 27 6 5 2 3 18 10 29 45
2 Man Utd 21 8 1 1 24 8 6 1 4 22 11 27 44
3 Arsenal 20 8 1 1 30 9 5 2 3 23 14 30 42
4 Tottenham 20 7 0 3 26 8 4 4 2 16 14 20 37
5 Man City 19 6 3 0 22 13 3 5 2 16 14 11 35
6 Aston Villa 20 6 2 2 17 7 4 3 3 12 11 11 35

A well run NUFC is not that far away from Villa and Spurs. And financially Man U and Liverpool are living on borrowed time.

I don't think the Prem League is worth all this pessimism. I seem to remember everyone saying we would flounder in the Championship.

We have to live in hope or what's the fucking point? If someone had told me when Ardiles and MacKeag were in charge that within a matter of a few years we would have a top class side challenging at the top of the league I would have laughed at them.

We are in a lot better state as a club in 2010 than we ever were in 1990 - regardless of what anyone may think.
11th January 2010 02:54 PM
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viana45 Offline

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genuinely confused?

What I want out of nufc

the ability to have a football conversation without nufc bein mocked
a manager that understands the fans football and players
players who appreciate the fans and who work well as a team an are fucking good
a club challenging for trophies
a club that doesn't shoot itself in the foot and give itself the best possible chance of sucess
a club that maximises a transfer kitty when compared to it's turnover
a club that won't buy shite players at big fees
a club that doesn't look out of place in the top 7
a club we can be proud of
an a club we can support without feeling guilty
because after the way this club has treated legends like KK and SBR there's a certain level of guilt.

We don't want what the media says we want. They seem to think we want free flowing 5-4s and 4-3's. I don't I want a team to fgve itself a chance. And to play football properly.
11th January 2010 02:56 PM
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rotti Offline

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flip your joking surely we are miles away from the likes of Birmingham nevermind Spurs/Villa m8.

What do you mean a well run NUFC dont say spending £100m on players and bringing in a new manager because i simply cant see any of this happening.

Remember m8 what Ashley stated when they fans wanted him out he said he wouldnt put in anymore funds and so far i dont think he has, but he has certainly took funds out the club.

We all know if we gain promotion that figure of £100m he wants for the club now will be dwarfed by the amount he will want if we get into the premier league, which he wont get.

In other words m8 we are lumbered with him like we were with fat fred.
11th January 2010 03:01 PM
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rotti Offline

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viana your post made me laugh m8 sorry.
11th January 2010 03:02 PM
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robleesheed Offline

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genuinely confused?

11th January 2010 03:12 PM
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rotti Offline

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I wasnt laughing at spelling m8 it was this

What I want out of nufc


a manager that understands the fans football and players
players who appreciate the fans and who work well as a team an are fucking good
a club challenging for trophies

a club that maximises a transfer kitty when compared to it's turnover
a club that won't buy shite players at big fees
a club that doesn't look out of place in the top 7
an a club we can support without feeling guilty

because after the way this club has treated legends like KK and SBR there's a certain level of guilt.
11th January 2010 03:16 PM
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richyNUFC Offline

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I'm tired of it all to be honest.

Just enjoying the on field events at the minute, winning more than we lose, top of the league and that, and not just at our club but results like Leeds at Old Trafford and Mali and Peterborough coming back from 4-0 down. Onfield, football is quite exciting at the minute.

Off field it's shite, again not just at our club, but all over.
11th January 2010 03:16 PM
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rotti Offline

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I want the club to win every game 4-0, i want an owner that makes bill gates look like a tramp, i want a 80k stadium full every home game and i want us to win every trophy available but when i wake up i know none of these things will ever happen.

We cant have what we really want m8, i want a Pioneer Kuro 60" tv but im not going to get one.
11th January 2010 03:19 PM
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rotti Offline

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Agree richy winning more than we lose, top of the league and that
11th January 2010 03:20 PM
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tino Offline

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in a perverse way we could be promoted at just the right time, especially if MA sells.

the premier league is riddled with bankrupt or poorly funded clubs. MANU need £60m+ a year just to fund the debts, Liverpool have wasted good money on their managers poor buys to the extent that they have to sell to buy, Spurs the same, Llardarse has to sell to buy, Bolton the same, Burnley have already gambled their lot, only CHelsea and Citeh have the ridiculous funds the others took for granted

Teams like Stoke have spent a little wisely, maintained their status with a style which suits them, not us, but they have accepted that to survivie in the first instance they needed to do a job and they did it well.

We need a good coach, not a great manager, and i wouldnt heisitate to suggesting Lee Clark and his team would be ideal to get a team effort moving forward.We have a few decent players young and old, not world beaters not superstars but people with the determination to stay up. we need to add a few cheapies and we should be ok


Of course MA could shite on us from high and cash in on a couple this window






Or is this all bollocks
11th January 2010 06:01 PM
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rotti Offline

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Id love to see LC here as manager but i doubt he would put up with Ashley's shite just like Shearer wouldnt.

tino we are that far behind most premier league clubs it would cost too much just to keep us up.

Look at us now and be honest how many clubs would this team beat in the premier league.

We are doing brilliantly so fat in the fizzy pop league but it is a world apart from the premier league.

We all know we are stuck with fatty until someone pays him what he wants which wont happen.

Id like to know how much ashley is really down on his investment with all the money he has raked in and the wages he has saved.
11th January 2010 06:19 PM
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tino Offline

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Rotti M8 i dont think we are that far behind in terms of squad, its just not coache dproperly and hasnt been since KK

He took the team to Old Trafford and got a good point, infact with a bit of luck we could have held on for the win

JFK and Hughton took the same squad down demoralising some on the way to the extent that Given and NZogbia left.

we now that the nucleus to stay, not very well and it may be a tough old slog but we could do it

we are, as you say light years from a challenge on any silverware
11th January 2010 06:24 PM
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rotti Offline

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We will be long dead before this club wins anything m8 sad but true.
11th January 2010 06:32 PM
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Lucian Offline

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i want knobs like butt geremi shola barton out of newcastle then ashley can follow them only for rich invester to come in and demote chris g to acadamy coach and bring in the special one and back him to the hilt

If carlsberg did dreams they be the best dreams in the world..
11th January 2010 06:33 PM
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